Thursday, November 22, 2012

Reader Submission From Germany Part 2

Hello! It's me, the german again.

As you may have noticed in my last article, I do not like Dating/PUA coaches.

Quick summary why:

1. They charge large amounts of money directly or try to upsell you into expensive seminars, coaching, whatever.

2. They exploit the addiction of men to sex/females and try to make money out of it.

3. They teach males questionable tricks, techniques and behaviour to be more successful with women. It boils down to "men have to do nearly all the work in the dating game, by learning this stuff and applying it". The more experienced guys and naturals have to also do all the work, but take the material from themselves, which is better anyways. This mindset is toxic because it makes the man responsible for his actions and the woman's inactions. So he is always to blame. It may also lead to even more women turning more passive, because they can get away with it due to most males addiction to sex/women.

4. Seeing it from the perspective of equality (woman and man both engage actively in courtship) nearly all the PU material, which coaches draw from, is useless. The concept of going out and approaching girls is good for social beginners to make some first experiences. But it also becomes kind of senseless, when you notice, that the numbers are stacked against you. Most people will stop completely or only approach marginally, when the woman is giving away obvious signals.
But even if you are willing to accept, that men have to do all the work, then you have the problem to validate, if it's really the material giving you success, or just you, being in a good pushy mood plus the women making it easy for you.
_____________________

Now let's try something new and let's debunk common pro-coaching statements.

1. ST: I will show you, how to get better with women, by teaching you a unique technique/system, which will make you better with women.

Unique? It's probably copied, repacked and remarketed under another name. And even if it's not, which I highly doubt, look above at 4. for the rest.
_______________________

2. ST: Techniques are soooo yesterday. They falsify your personality. You have to be yourself! I will just show you how to behave accordingly in daygame and I promise you, you will bath in pussy! I will show you how to approach women EVERYWHERE, ANYTIME!

A more sophisticated and indeed better one. But still horrible.

"Techniques are bad and falsify the personality. Also, you should be yourself, when dealing with women."

Yes, you got it bro. Let's move on.

So daygame mass approaching everywhere, anytime. That sounds like law of averages or numbers game. It comes down to being an approach machine. If you do 20+ or even 15+ women everyday with ongoing motivation (EVERYFUCKINGWHERE! ALWAYS! NO EXCUSES BITCH!) and most importantly with direct approaches, you can filter out the women, who look good and are interested in you. That is of course no indicator, that they are willing to do their part of the share.
But if you do not require that and are a social, constantly motivated, well groomed guy, who has alot of time, you will get laid.

To be honest, if I would ever again engage myself in chasing women, that would be the method, I go for. However, I would do it only as long as it needs to take, till I get a good girlfriend out of it.

Okay, enough sugar for now. Now let's get the mud. You can partially apply that mud on nightgame also.

- Motivation is the most important factor. You have to be constantly motivated for the interested 11th chick, even if you get ignored or laughed at by the first 10 girls. You have to constantly push yourself, to meet your daily limit, because it is a numbers game. You have to constantly push yourself to approach that chick in the train and still be motivated for the 10 more to go, if she shoots you down and everyone is looking at you.

- You have to be persistent. That means you have to go out in the field at best every day, if you want to have a supply of numbers, dates and at best, girls. No excuses. Do not let your approach ratio drop. But honestly, if you have this problem, then you are not motivated anyway.

- You need a constant fucking lot of time to achieve constant sex or even dates.

For people with a normal 8-10 hour/day job, it is impossible to achieve this. Here is the solution. Go into the coaching business. Charge a lot of money for showing this method and talking about how to behave in daygame. Motivational speeches are very important also.

Work on a good website and bootcamp program and when this is set up, be sure to throw in some gimmicks like an article, some opening line or a video, every now and then. Promotion and stuff is needed either.

The rest of the month is free! You can go out and have all day to approach chicks or learn some interesting rhetoric tricks. No time pressure, so you can relax. You will gain experience way faster, and eventually become really good. So even more time to idle and ask yourself, why only a few students have concrete results at hand, but others are confusing feeling pumped up and motivated for a short amount of time with results.

- Motivation problems. You will encounter them. 100 percent. Sooner or later. They are one of the  main reasons, people run to coaches. They need their fix. Like the Cocaine addict his cocaine.

Be not one of them. Better be pretty fucking honest with yourself.

Now it is true, that coaches can pump up your motivation again and keep you going. The world is sunshine again and you feel fresh! But only short term. Now if you are lucky, you will get laid with one or more chicks through that motivation high. Hurray. Sex for 1000 euros.

But then let's say the chick vanishes after 2-3 months. What now?

Your motivation is probably down and you can't get it up. Coaching time again.

I met guys, who were motivated for weeks after a coaching. Only to return after the next downfall set in. Some coaches even have coaching flatlines. It's a vicious circle.

Do not go into it, or if you are. BREAK OUT. Read this and the other blogs of john. That will help you see things how they are.

So. Be honest. Is the sex or attention you get, worth the work you do? Really ask yourself.
_______________________

How to daygame

You need some social skills to start with and you should have some basic directions of daygame.

What? Never been on the street before and no social experience with girls? Also no self confidence, so sarging alone is out of option. Well, before you hit the button, which will transfer 1000 € to the bank account of some coach, let me tell you whats up.

First, you need confidence.

Option 1

Get a wingman from the local PUA lair and let him introduce you to the world of street approaching. Hope he is not a douche. Chances are, that he will try to push theory into your head. Unfortunately, many PUAs especially in the lairs, are completely confused by the sheer amount of material, which is available and therefore babble bullshit. Too many Opportunists. I will later on quickly summarize what you need.

Option 2

Do not touch pickup or girls yet. First get a social life, by pursuing some hobbies. If you do not have any, then take the courage and just sign up for a karate course. Or Art? Maybe a foreign language? You can drop it later if you want. Point is, to get to know some people and maybe make some friends.

Option 3

Better than option 1. Get a friend involved and ask him to go out with you on the streets. Maybe that friend of yours is naturally good with girls and can assist or help you even. If he is not, it does not matter. You just need some company to approach those dangerous beasts!

So. You are ready to go out. You are well groomed? If not take care of that. Ask a preferable female person, what clothes and haircut would look good on you. Or watch the people on the streets for some inspiration. Or just ask the saleswoman of the next shop or your barber.

I hope you read, what i wrote above. Not so much the sugar coated stuff, but the mud coated. That is the stuff, they normally do not tell you (for real, it's not a hook. It would be a bad hook anyways, because its negative).

Here is what you need:

1. There is no definitive technique on making a girl stop on the street and recognize you. Just keep three things in your head. Try to hold eye contact with her, have a loud clear voice (do not scream...), and smile (very important). Approach chicks, who walk slow and are not in a hurry. Maybe a park? Or look in different kind of shops. I liked book stores most.

2. Oh mah gawd. What to say?!

Easy. Relax. Smile. Just say "Hi" and tell her, that you just saw her and think she looks beautiful. If she reacts positive with a smile and a thank you, introduce yourself, shake her hand and ask her, what she is doing at the moment. From here on you talk with her. On your own. No techniques or shit like that.

Just relax and try to enjoy it. If it does not work out, do not worry, do not blame yourself and just move on. With time and practice, your certainty will rise.

If you have the balls to approach groups, introduce yourself and tell them, that you think your target is cute. Ask, if you can kidnap (haha!) her real short. If yes, nice. If no, move on. Do not forget the smile.

3. She laughed at me and her friends were mean!!!

Yeah, I told you, that can happen. It's emotionally very stressful. So where is the motivation now?

Anyways, move on. Next chick.

4. Approach chicks, who walk slow and are not in a hurry. When they are smiling without reason, approach them. You can approach women who phone, or listen to music. Sometimes it works, sometimes not.

Approach women in bookstores, when they are browsing through books. Try it out.

5. Do not forget to have fun with your buddy! :-)

6. After 2-3 months of constant experience, go out alone. Now you need real self confidence. You cannot have your buddy with you all the time.

7. Experiment, but she always should know fairly soon, that you are romantically interested in her. So no completely indirect shit. If she says, she has a friend or is not interested, move on. Persistence is a stupid filler concept, coined to sell more shit.

8. Use your critical mind. Do not go to coaches, even if someone wants to convince you. Look for your own way. You are for example automatically funny, when you are relaxed with a girl and have some social experience. They cannot teach you experience.

9. We go out and I push you into sets. I also explain what you have done wrong in my opinion, saying stuff like "Hold more eye contact." or "Hold her hand longer, to convey more sexual interest". or "be more relaxed and funny." I smile a lot, I am energetic, appear sincere and motivate you! Then you give me 1000 €.

Part 2 in progress. If you know more coaching endorsing statements, please post them in the comment section.

Greetings

11 comments:

Anonymous said...

Good write -up. But nothing beats having a bit of money and/or fame. Saves dancing around the sidelines. Going outside of Northern America or Northern Europe makes a noticeable difference.

I go to Colombia and if anyone there were to pay for lessons on how to talk to women, they'd be laughed out of the country.

Anonymous said...

Hum. I wonder if women know all this is going on?

The German said...

I can imagine that some women know the scene, especially in america through media exposure.
We also have some females here in germany, who hang out on lairs. But for the big majority, more than 99 percent, the PU scene is invisible. They maybe know, that there is a dating scene with coaches for males and even females.
However, they do not know what the body of knowledge is, which is taught. As i stated above, the body of knowledge in PU is mainly, that the man has to do all the work. So the pressure is on him, to indirectly impress her with stories, to be cocky and funny, even if he does not feel like it and much more.

The point is, that women do not need to know anything about it, because some are getting confrontated with it, in clubs, bars, or daygame locations.
Example:
A woman gets approached by a PUA, who has some experience and his material together. If its his own material, its good.
She does not know, that he is a PUA obviously, but she thinks he is cute looking, so she does not shoot him down and is receptive to him.
Now you have in my experience an extremely small minority of women, who will actively engage in conversation, introduce new themes on their own, telling jokes and doing their share.

The big rest will stay passive. They will even talk a little bit if you ask them stuff or laugh and comment on some funny joke you crack. If they are impressed by you, they will start asking questions themselves, getting a little bit more open. However, you will always find yourself in the position of doing the most talking, telling all the jokes, conveying your character and escalating sexually.

Note, that you can of course succeed nevertheless, having a makeout or even sex, when the female is passive at courtship, but likes you.
But it will not happen that often, unless you approach many women, have good social experience, look good and are in a good mood. You also need motivation.
I also assume, that you go for girls, who are looking attractive.

In my opinion, it is just too much work for getting the chance for sex or makeouts. And its kind of shallow, because it often appeared to me, that she is just a faceless human without any noticable opinion or character. Good looking indeed. But you also look good in her eyes. Otherwise she would have rejected you, at the beginning.

Do you know the common picture of the girl, who falls in love with the good looking man at a disco/club/bar/daytime avenue, has sex with him and than he never replies again and leaves her with a broken heard?

Chances are very high, that she is one of those demanding and shallow girls, i described above. So he does all the work and finally they both enjoy sex. After the sex, he thinks hard:

"I know she is demanding, because i had to do nearly all the talk, for us to enjoy sex" [Negative]

"I know nearly nothing about her character, because i had to do nearly all the talk, for us to enjoy sex." [Negative]

"When she talked, she answered only on a question, a suggestion or a theme, i introduced." [Negative]

"She laughed at all my jokes, but only made me laugh one or two times (or never)" [Negative]

"Nevertheless i enjoyed doing all the work, because it felt good. It felt good, because she looked good in my eyes, which i also did in her eyes. Fuck equality. (Leave that out, if she did not look above average)" [Postive!..ugh, or not...]

Kind of a long answer with some added thoughts.

I can fully support the statement, that girls in some other countries are alot easier to get with and actually do their share.
I also gave an example for that in my first submission.
I also know someone, who flys to the philippines. He also says, what a big difference it is and how much better the women are there.
On the other hand, you have to watch out for gold diggers, since the countries are often poor and be careful, about long term relationships. But they are not all gold diggers.

Greetings

Anonymous said...

Women don`t need to approach guys they can wait till a guy is doing everything for them

Anonymous said...

>>Do you know the common picture of the girl, who falls in love with the good looking man at a disco/club/bar/daytime avenue, has sex with him?<<

I'm very skeptical about being told anyone has sex nowdays. Men can't get it and women don't want it. Unless the man is rich and/or famous. And I never saw anyone actually meet in a nightclub and go and have sex. That's the truth. Warren Farrell rightly wrote that good looking women want more than good looking men. When a woman talks about a man and his looks it is usually only in ADDITION to his wallet or his fame. From the age of 18 I went out 100s of times to nightclubs and never once went from there to have sex with anyone. I was quite handsome, presentable etc. And never did I see anyone else take women out with them from there. i think it's all an illusion.

Anonymous said...

>>On the other hand, you have to watch out for gold diggers<<

I would say that about ANY country. The only difference is that it's far cheaper outside Northern USA and Northern Europe - the two places to avoid.

John said...

"I'm very skeptical about being told anyone has sex nowdays. Men can't get it and women don't want it. Unless the man is rich and/or famous. And I never saw anyone actually meet in a nightclub and go and have sex. That's the truth. Warren Farrell rightly wrote that good looking women want more than good looking men. When a woman talks about a man and his looks it is usually only in ADDITION to his wallet or his fame. From the age of 18 I went out 100s of times to nightclubs and never once went from there to have sex with anyone. I was quite handsome, presentable etc. And never did I see anyone else take women out with them from there. i think it's all an illusion."

*** lol, there is indeed lots of sex going on. The problem is with the type of doors that lead to sex. You either have to have the right social circle connections, through school, work, or friends (while still playing the stupid courtship/dating game), OR you have to approach like a maniac and get rejected an obscene amount of times, plus humiliation, before you meet a woman who is up to the task of having sex with you.

The German said...

"I would say that about ANY country. The only difference is that it's far cheaper outside Northern USA and Northern Europe - the two places to avoid."


Yes, you are right.

Anonymous said...

"This mindset is toxic because it makes the man responsible for his actions and the woman's inactions. So he is always to blame"

Exactly! I'm tired of PUA telling men that they have to do xyz to make a woman feel comfortable and entertained by you. Forget that. Keep the focus on yourself. I can't be held responsible for her entertainment or her comfort, I'm too busy worried about how I feel and my own comfort&entertainment level to care about hers.

The German said...

"Exactly! I'm tired of PUA telling men that they have to do xyz to make a woman feel comfortable and entertained by you. Forget that. Keep the focus on yourself. I can't be held responsible for her entertainment or her comfort, I'm too busy worried about how I feel and my own comfort&entertainment level to care about hers."

Indeed.
One big mistake of the PUA's is, pressuring the man into making jokes/telling stories etc. They even have constructed jokes and canned stories to learn and apply.
The direction some PUAs (and ofc coaches...) go, is officially shitting on techniques, declaring them impersonal. That is correct.
However the core thought did not change. You have to care for her entertainment and so on.

If iam with a girl, who likes me and talks a little bit, the fun will flow automatically. Not always, but in most cases. But if i look at it critically, iam the one who does the most. I just like to make her laugh, i guess. Iam used to it.
The big difference is, that i do it, because i like it and not because i feel pressure to do it.
But in order to do joking, i have to feel good in her presence and she also must pay attention. I also do not do it over longer periods of time (1 hour max), because it gets boring and my interest is dropping. Why does it get boring and why does my interest level drop?
Because in nearly all cases, she does not do her share. She does not tell jokes, nor does she talk much. In fact, i rarely heard a women telling a joke.
Yes, she smiles and looks at you. Some superficial comments.
And yes, she looks attractive.
But face it. She is a nice looking and demanding human doll, nothing more. Good for sex, if you are very lucky and get through. But thats all. The biggest mistake is to marry one of these.
A prostitute does look attractive also. She smiles and looks at you. PLUS you get 100 percent sex and not a small 5 percent chance. PLUS You do not have to play the stupid dating game, nor do any work other than pay. PLUS you are the customer and do not have to sell yourself.

I know exactly, why iam never going out anymore with another purpose, than having fun. I rarely go out to party.
Going through that PUA shit for 2.5 years with a critical mind was very educating in some ways and finding that blog helped alot, to see the actual truth on cold approaching women and the dating game in general.

Anonymous said...

Never thought about it like that, but you're right, they really are just slightly animated dolls! They laugh at your jokes sometimes, and make simple responses, but they rarely contribute anything useful or interesting to the interaction. You play with them when you want, then after you're done you just put them back on the shelf!

PUA teaches men that they have to do all of the work when it comes to interacting with women, while women invest very little if any effort into the situation. Most of the time their just experiencing what you're bringing to the interaction, but they don't have much to bring of their own.

I take the same approach as you, as I only go out to have fun now without any regard to what the women are feeling, how comfortable they are, or worrying about if they're getting bored with me. I realize that I can't be responsible for those things so my main focus now is letting women know what I want from them and seeing if they will return or reject my desires.